From left: Glenn Cockburn, Kyle Irving, Richard Jean-Baptise, Tonya Williams and The Globe and Mail’s Barry Hertz at the Banff World Media Festival on June 10.Supplied
It is not an easy time to be a Canadian film or TV actor. Two weeks ago, the Canadian Screen Awards handed out three of its top four lead-acting honours to non-Canadian performers (none of whom showed up to collect their statuettes). Meanwhile, the rise of borderless online influencers and content creators from non-traditional platforms calls into question just what a “star,” Canadian or otherwise, even means today.
At the Banff World Media Festival this week, The Globe and Mail sat down with key players in the country’s screen industry – Tonya Williams (founder of Toronto’s Reelworld Screen Institute), Kyle Irving (co-owner of Winnipeg’s Eagle Vision production company), Richard Jean-Baptiste (vice-president of Montreal’s Attraction production company) and Glenn Cockburn (president of Toronto agency Meridian Artists) – for an on-stage discussion about rethinking Canadian talent, how we might be able to elbows-up our way into developing the next generation of homegrown stars.
It’s clear to everyone here that a star system has never really existed in English-language Canada. Why do we need to establish one now?
Tonya Williams: I’ve been on my soapbox about this for 40 years, but recently I’ve been listening to people say, “How do we get our content more discoverable? How do we get audiences to watch? How do we get international players to buy it?” What we need to do is to put our performers front and centre and market them in the best way possible.
Glenn Cockburn: A star system is obviously a beneficial thing to happen for the industry, but to what end? Is the purpose to promote Canadian actors internationally, regardless of where they’re working? Is it to promote domestic Canadians internationally so that they can grow their celebrity? Or are we trying to promote Canadians living in Canada so that our audiences can become more familiar with them?
Kyle Irving: At the Canadian Screen Awards, we’re giving out our acting awards to people who aren’t even from Canada and who, frankly, don’t care that they won – they never show up. Why don’t we just change the rules? Paul Spence, who was in our movie Deaner ’89, was up for the award that Cate Blanchett won, and that would have been a game-changer for him. The broadcasters don’t seem to have a lot of interest in pushing our stars and our content. The streamers sure don’t. Let’s start being smart about the things we have easy controls over, and start building from that.
Over the past few days in Banff, I’ve heard contradictions about how important or not stars are. Netflix has said stars don’t matter, it’s all about story. CBC said that it tries to make stars out of the people you know, and the people who you should know. Does the recognizability of talent move the needle in getting something made and seen?
Richard Jean-Baptiste: In Quebec, we have a very strong system because of the language differences, and in the way that we tell stories and our certain cultural differences. That being said, the reach of an individual on social media is super important. The fact that someone like LOL’s Patrick Huard has a reach in Quebec is important.
Williams: I want to go back to what Glenn said about the purpose of a star system, because it’s a “yes” to all those things – it’s about approaching something from many different angles. What are the other things we can leverage from this actor from all different platforms on all different levels that bring audiences to a production? What we don’t have today are the talk shows. We used to have people on the cover of magazines. Ad agencies in Canada should also be thinking that this actor could be perfect for this campaign. And of course social media. It’s about bombarding the audience.
Irving: We’ve lost so many of the things that we used to have. But I’m going to go back to the foundational thing: CBC does not use their own resources to promote the talent on their shows. The left hand never talks to the right at that place.
Nunavut-set comedy North by North was recently renewed for a second season. The show stars Anna Lambe as Siaja.jasper savage/CBC/APTN/Netflix
Discoverability seems key. Something I’ve felt this week at Banff is that we could all play a drinking game every time someone mentions the success of North of North. But from my vantage point, I didn’t feel awareness of that series when CBC first aired it. I only noticed the marketing when it started to stream on Netflix. That feels like a problem.
Irving: As Canadians, we need to get past the idea that something we make is only cool if the Americans think so. Ask Quebec.
Jean-Baptiste: I hear this conversation, but we really live in two different worlds. You’re talking about the CBC not doing enough, but if you’re a star or want to be a star in Quebec and you’re not on a show called Tout le monde en parle on Radio-Canada, then you’re not consecrated.
Irving: Mark Carney gave the CBC $150-million to prop it up, and promised to give more every year. Let’s put some strings on that money. Let’s tell the CBC how we want it to be used to elevate our shows, our talent, our discoverability, so that Canadians can see themselves reflected on-screen.
Cockburn: I watched a lot of hockey on the CBC and they advertised the hell out of North of North during the playoffs. But let’s talk about Canadian stars, because we are pretty good about making them in this country. But the key thing is retention. We cannot have a conversation about a star system without acknowledging that we have a massive talent drain to Los Angeles. It’s not about preventing people from going, but how we make sure they stay invested in the Canadian system in some way.
Williams: Producers need to be braver. Supinder Wraich is here, she’s the star of CBC’s Allegiance. Producers now should be developing her next show. She is one of our Canadian stars, and she needs to be treated that way, but she’s told me stories about how her agents say, “Oh yeah, we don’t do that,” so she’s on her own trying to make her show a hit.
Cockburn: Full disclosure, we are her agents. And we talk with Supinder a lot and celebrate her a lot …
Williams: [laughs] I meant the American ones …
Cockburn: We are talking about a system, though, and there are some immediate things we can do. No. 1: We can all start being more positive about this industry. We have a lot to celebrate and the last 10 years of Canadian media has been extraordinary.
Let’s talk about marketing budgets …
Williams: It is actually surprising when you look at budgets at many of the shows and you see less than 10 per cent on marketing, whereas marketing really has to be almost more than the entire production budget.
Irving: It’s so anti-Canadian to put money toward marketing. We have a social system that supports our industry, and we’re the envy of the world for that. We are lucky, because it’s the only way we can have an identity when the big machine is right there on the other side. That being said, we need to change the philosophy around that money. This idea that Canadian taxpayer dollars might go to promote Canadian shows, it’s been something that you can’t do. And why?
Jean-Baptiste: We need to be audacious, innovative, and try things. Advertising agencies know that. All the tools are on the tables. And with this unity that we’re gaining right now because of what’s going on in the world and south of the border, that’s an even greater context to try things and let the money flow differently.
This discussion has been condensed and edited.
