The Fire This Time Festival Enters Its 16th Year

Founder Kelley Girod and Artistic Director Cezar Williams discuss preparations for the 2025 Festival with Theatre Times Editor Marcina Zaccaria.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How does it feel to be in the 16th year of producing The Fire This Time Festival?

KELLEY GIROD: It’s truly unbelievable.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Cezar, As the Artistic Director, how do you think the Festival has grown?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: I think our status in the community and the theater community has grown.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How did you select the Playwrights this year?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: That is a great question.  I’m so glad you asked that.  I wish more people knew this.  So, the system for the play selection is prior Playwrights or Playwrights who’ve been in the Festival before nominate Playwrights to submit for the season.

A.J. Muhammad, our incredible Literary Manager, collects all the plays then makes them blind, so we don’t know who wrote which play, and then a committee sits down and figures out which plays we want to do.  But, the caveat is – there’s a bunch of factors like we try to have an ensemble of five to six actors, so let’s say your play has eight people in it, it may not get selected … We’re trying to match themes, we’re trying to make sure that we are representing what’s in the ethos.  I think one of the things that makes it special every single year is the plays were just written like within that calendar year, and so very often, they are speaking to what the community is thinking about at the time.

This season, a lot of the plays are about care.  Be it caregiver syndrome or what issues we prioritize that we care about, who we care about, how we care about people, so we wanted to make sure that we match what we receive.  So, we get 50 plays, we pick 5 or 6 plays, so if people are talking about it, we are talking about it.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How are you specifically now developing the voices of mature Playwrights?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: Ohh, I am jumping up and down at that question.  Thank you so much for asking that.  That has been intentional.

It’s kind of complex – make sure I answer your question, like at the end of this.  I’m going to say a bunch of stuff, but I want to make sure I answer your specific question.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Absolutely, absolutely.  Like I said, you know, we have penciled in an hour and a half, so you can kind of dance (around it), and you can treat this interview as a little bit more like a roundtable, where, if there’s something that’s like a springboard –  it inspires something that’s always been at the core of the Festival or something that you always wanted people to know about Fire This Time – feel free to use the question as a springboard.

I was just really impressed by the mature Playwrights, and it seemed clear to me that you were looking for them to even develop further.  So, how do you do that?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: So, it’s kind of the first thing is trying to do it.  We thought there was a gap in the industry.  There are a number of programs for Under 30 Playwrights, but not as many for more mature Playwrights, so we wanted to do that.  It also aids in the storytelling that then we have intergenerational plays, or plays about people who are a little bit older, hopefully, and therefore, it adds more flavor and texture to the stage – to the American stage which is something we think is very, very important.  And, then specifically to the Playwrights themselves.

Our mission is to amplify the career of Black Playwrights.  That’s our mission, and by giving them exposure in the Festival and all the people that come to the Festival.  Looking for the next, whomever, you know, Dominique Morisseau, Jordan Cooper, Kelley Girod.

Whatever exposure we could give them to their careers and their voices and just to validate them in the industry, I think, is important because I think more mature writers are very often under-looked and under-valued here.  As well, the Festivals are a two year residency.  Actually, the first year is the 10-Minute Festival, but the second year, we help them to begin developing a full-length project.  And so, it’s two years that we’re working with them, and the relationship never ends.  Once you’re in The First Time family, you’re always in it.  I write more letters of recommendation for other productions, for agents.  Some of our writers, including the mature ones, are going to grad school.  I write a lot of recommendations for Columbia, Yale, Juilliard, you know you name it, NYU – all the places.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: I’m wondering, as I’m hearing you, was that the original goal of the Festival when you created it, Kelley, or has it branched into that over time?

The Mural featuring Larry Powell and Shayvawn Webster. Photo credit: Garlia Jones.

KELLEY GIROD: I think that the wonderful thing, about that part, about the Festival.  You know, especially you know, Kevin R. Free was our Artistic Director, and now under Cezar’s direction, the Festival has really been able to flourish and to grow and all of these wonderful and different ways.  When I founded this Festival, I was like a 20-something.  You weren’t necessarily thinking that far about you’re not thinking 16 years into your career, as a theater-maker, as a Playwright.  So, I think that the wonderful thing is that as we grow and develop in the industry, we are recognizing and seeing where there are gaps and seeing where there were holes.  

And, that and the original intention always was that there is a gap in the industry that nobody else sees, we’re going to fill that gap, and I think that we kind of continue to do that, particularly with how we program.  Making sure that we are constantly creating space.  I want to highlight this whole thing about mature writers.  Writers who have been toiling in anonymity for years … a lot of people who get their “break” in their 20s, you know, that’s it’s few and far between.   So, I personally feel that there are a lot of people who are writing their best in their 30s and their 40s and beyond.  I’ll just speak for myself.  I’m a better writer now than I was 16 years ago.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Kelley, you have a great new position at the Apollo.  You’re the Director of New Works.  Has your new position opened up any new means of audience building?  What techniques are you using at the Apollo down at the wild project?

KELLEY GIROD: When I took my position at the Apollo, it kind of felt like I was just doing on a larger scale what we already do with The Fire This Time. Our communities are so similar.  If someone is doing something up at the Apollo, and you know, and because of the length of time, that The Fire This Time has been around, probably there are some way, shape, and form connected to The Fire This Time community, so you know being able to uplift them on the Fire This Time socials or the newsletters.  If they’re doing something up at the Apollo that has been amazing and like vice versa . . .  It’s literally like the same kind of community as the Fire This Time . . . We break bread together, we work together.  We see everything together, and they have been really huge supporters of the Fire This Time, whether that is them, you know, coming down, seeing the shows, being able to shout things out on the Apollo socials.

Like our Executive Producer of the Apollo, Kamilah Forbes, has worked in the front of This Time in the years past, and she’s been on panels before . . . We’re just like making the pool of resources even bigger.  In that way it’s just been a really kind of beautiful, like organic, serendipitous thing that we kind of just are able to work together, because we have so many artists that we share in the community.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Terrific!  Say out loud your new title and exactly what your day-to-day responsibilities are.

Kelley Girod at The Apollo.  Photo courtesy of The Fire This Time Festival.

KELLEY GIROD: I’m the Director of New Works.  The New Works Program at Apollo is about 5 years old.  The Apollo Campus has expanded, and we are now next door to the historic theater and have two new theaters and a gallery.  So, the New Works Program is really about finding those artists who are going to really see the classics that we will come and know to love.  In the same way, what we’re doing with the Fire This Time.  We really find ways to support that work through residencies, so we may give one or two week long residencies to an artist to build a new work, commissioning new work, and finding ways to be a part of work that is in development for us to partner with other institutions.  We’ve created great partnerships with The Metropolitan Opera.  We’ve commissioned a new work by Billy Childs, and so we’re also working with them on new opera, new dance pieces, you name it.  We do a little bit of everything.  Now that we have the gallery that also includes curating and supporting the work of visual artists, as well.

So, my job in a nutshell, my day-to-day, is as if the Fire This Time ran year-round, it would be similar.  Finding artists, nurturing them, supporting them.  Seeing their work to fruition, and creating a community of support.  We really try to do this at the Apollo New Works, too.  It’s really how do we continue to keep people and community.  How do we do that? … So, I think my building The Fire This Time actually really equips me well to be able to do something like have this major position at the Apollo. 

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Cezar, how are you holding on to the other key staff people that you’ve always had at Fire This Time, like A.J. Muhammad?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: Oh goodness.  Through prayer? I think the first time as a family, yes, so you know we have A.J. Muhammad, we have Julienne Hairston, we have Danielle Covington, and Angelica Cherí. Once you’re in the family, you’re always in the family. Maybe, you’ll go off and do an individual project here or there, but it’s never a goodbye.  Especially with A.J. Muhammad.  A.J. is such an important resource to the Fire This Time Festival.  I cannot imagine it working without someone up with A.J.’s particular talents and skills and so just about trying to value each other and care for each other.  I think if you care for people and people see that they are valued, they’ll stay.  They want to grow with you, as long as we are all growing, as we match our individual growth with our organizational growth.  As Kelley’s standing in the community grew, she brought those resources to the Fire This Time.  I remember when Kelley brought TDF on board and what a huge change that was.  I remember when Kelley brought PBS All Arts on board, and what a huge change that was. And so I think it’s that synergy that we’ve been very fortunate to have at The Fire This Time. 

KELLEY GIROD: Can I follow up on that, though? I need to give Cezar Williams major flowers, here.  Cezar Williams is an excellent Artistic Director, but not just that.  Cezar is the type of person you want to continue to be around.  Cezar fosters an environment that allows people to be able to grow and to think about their growth.  We sit down as a family and Cezar goes around and says, what does everybody need this year.  Last year, in Season 15, Team Member Danielle Covington said she missed acting.  She wanted to act again.  So, we really found a way to be able to support her in that with The Fire This Time.  I could go on and say a million examples about what that does.  I feel like Cezar really takes the time to really nurture people at all levels, but especially the team.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: It’s been 16 years now.  It probably seems like a really long time since 2010.  It seems like so much has happened in a lot of ways.  The theater industry is interesting that way because it grows, but we see a lot of changes in popular culture and in contemporary culture.  So, what are we seeing that’s new in the male/ female dynamic, and will we be seeing any particularly explosive moments this year?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: That’s a good point.  I mean, everything from the language that we use has changed.  Our sensibilities, our sensitivities in relationships have changed.  This season is really focused on that we have a play called Security Watch by TyLie Shider that is about this couple where the husband is still in love with his deceased wife, and they going to have a debate what argument or discussion or a love-off, or whatever you want to call it about who gets prioritized over whom.

We have another beautiful play called Just One Good Day by Jeanette W. Hill, which is a story of a husband and a wife where the husband suffers from early onset dementia and so it’s dealing with caregiver syndrome and that frustration of the person who needs the care along the frustration of the person who’s providing the care.  That’s another explosive play.  Pound Cake is about Billie Holiday and a gentleman that she is dealing with.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: What are the Playwrights finding exactly, in the way that they’re dealing with language and speech, and moment to moment action on stage.  How is it new, in terms of the sensitivity?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: There is a certain awareness of when you are caring for someone and when you are not that I didn’t see in the plays, say 5-6 years ago.  

Cezar Williams in rehearsal. Photo courtesy of The Fire This Time Festival.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How do you build these collaborative teams?  I want to hear about your process, and how you put together teams.

CEZAR WILLIAMS: My philosophy is to try to make this space as artist-led as possible, which is slightly different than artist-centered because the artist centered environment kind of says.  I know the artist needs, so I’m going to give the artists what they need – as opposed to – artists led, where we ask the artist what do you want, and then we do our best to make that happen.  So, we select the plays first, and that kind of becomes the framework under which we have to work because the plays have this many characters in it . . .  then, we hire the director, and then what we do is we basically just allow the director to select their team – the Stage Manager, the Designers that they want to work with, and do the casting, in whatever way they want to do… It is led by the plays, and then by the Director.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: What do you love about the 10-minute play form?

KELLEY GIROD: It always was an opportunity to give us an immense amount of diversity and voice.  You know, The Fire This Time was built on, came out of a lot of frustration of feeling at the time, like 16 years ago.  You know, there was only one type of way that Black artists could present themselves.  There was really only room for one or two types of different voices, and you know, with the 10-minute play, you can produce six to seven Playwrights at once.  You can show people the immense amounts of diversity in voice, in the storytelling, within the Black community, which at now seems like such an absurd notion that we would have to show that there is range and diversity within Black storytelling.  You get to experience a lot of different genres, so you could go from a serious genre to a comedy to a thriller to something that’s sci-fi based …  just really get to go on a very full journey, and so does the audience, as well.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: I want to ask you a little bit about location.  When I looked online at your performance history, you started around the E 4th Street area where the Kraine is, and then you kind of migrated down the street to the wild project which wasn’t even there.  So, what drew you to go ahead?

KELLEY GIROD: After I graduated from Columbia, I was like just looking for any kind of theatrical experiences to just kind of reset me.  I had a friend who was in the Acting Program at Columbia, and he was doing this new company of actors down on E 4th Street called The Drafts, and that’s how I got introduced to what was then called Horse Trade Theater.  At the time, they operated the Red Room, the Kraine Theater, and Under Saint Marks, and they had an additional space called Fanfare.  So, I wrote a 10-minute play for The Drafts.  I asked if I could intern there, and under my internship, I said I have an idea for a Festival.  Erez Ziv, who was with the Managing Director, then and is still now, said to have the Festival there … That’s literally how the Fire This Time started and has been.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How long of a performance is it this year?  I know it’s six 10-minute plays, so it would be about an hour?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: With the 10-minute play format, we add in some elements.  Sometimes, there’s some music.  There’s a few of the things that make them go a little bit longer, but I say the whole evening would be 90 minutes start-to-finish.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: How do you mix comedy and drama through the evening?

CEZAR WILLIAMS: We do have a mixture of genres represented, so that people feel, you know, at that cliché, you laugh, you cry.  We try to have that when we’re selecting the plays, and then, between myself the Director Kimille Howard and A.J. Muhammad, we will put the plays in an order, so that not only they tell a certain story, but they also take the audience to a certain emotional journey hopefully satisfying by the end.

MARCINA ZACCARIA: Kelley, is there anything else that you’d like to say?  Is being a Producer different now for you than it has been in the past?

KELLEY GIROD: When we started producing, like literally, I mean it was like the Wild West.  If we hadn’t really invested in community and invested in the safety and security and creating a good environment, so from that perspective, I think that I’ve really learned.  I’ve been able to bring that to the Apollo, you know, when we’re setting up a residency or we’re setting up any space that artists have to come into.  It’s exactly what Cezar said – it’s Artist led.  If we’re asking an Artist, what do you need?  It’s not something that they get asked often.

I would say my views have definitely grown steadily like over the past 16 years … the thing I found is the strongest, most powerful piece of advice as the Producer is to really invest in your community –  invest in your community in a real way, not just when you have something that you think applies to them, but all day every day, invest in cultivating people and really being a part of their lives in a real way.

The Fire This Time Festival is presented by FRIGID New York at wild project, located at 195 East 3rd Street, New York, NY 10009.  It is running from January 23-February 2, 2025.

Benton Greene, Danielle Covington, and Marinda Anderson. Photo credit: Garlia Jones.

The plays in the 16th year of the Festival include:

Pound Cake

Written by Brittany Fisher

A young Billie Holiday awaits a medical evaluation as she considers signing up to be a testing candidate for a procedure she believes will alter her memory, as doctors enter the early stages of discovering the lobotomy. While she waits, she has a life-changing encounter.

OUT

Written by FELISPEAKS

“OUT” is a short play about a Nigerian mother and her Black Irish daughter navigating the complexities of queer identity and what it means to be a part of the LGBTQIA+ community. It is about learning, loss and acceptance.

Just One Good Day

Written by Jeanette W. Hill

As the full-time caregiver for her husband Greg, Sonya Davidson battles the overwhelming burden of his deteriorating health, struggling with feelings of inadequacy, anger, and guilt. As she yearns for one day of normalcy, she fears that in holding on to the man she loves…she may lose herself.

But Not Forgotten

Written by D.L. Patrick

“But Not Forgotten” is a conversation between two sisters — one of whom is missing, and the other who keeps the search, and her sister’s memory, alive.  It is about the bonds of sisterhood that transcend time, space and death.  

Security Watch

Written by TyLie Shider

Hagar and Abram are getting ready for a romantic, life changing, work-night out, until a keepsake drives a sharp wedge between them and causes them to question the security of their relationship.

Immanentize the Eschaton

Written by Garrett Turner

The workers at this car part factory are just trying to get by—until they encounter their newest co-worker. She has a lot to say, and it might cause trouble. Or will it cause revolution?